Discussion in 'Squad Help' started by Dgmr, Mar 28, 2021.
Ha, yeah OK - nice! Thanks for the invite to the recruiting server, am checking it out…
Hi all - since the big news in the Road Ahead I’ve been reading the posts and watching some YT. My sense is I’m going to keep pressing ahead as planned, but curious to hear any thoughts on whether a change is warranted. I’m currently farming DR, then plan to chase Malak for a plateau team. From there it was going to be SLKR. Since I currently don’t run into any GLs (and thus don’t need counters…yet), I think I’m OK for now…? Or is it time to just go all in on a GL?
I don’t think it really changes anything. GLs are going to be harder to beat, but you really didn’t have those counters yet. Hopefully by the time you’ would be in a position to need them, people will have come up with new ones.
As far as which GL to go for Kylo is still the best first one by far. I think an argument could be made for JMK being better in all the game modes, but his requirements make it so I can’t imagine anyone being able to make him their first GL. R8 material can be bought, but you need to be in a good guild to be able to get the Negotiator and Wat. It’s not something you can really buy (for now). Same with Lord Vader. It’s just not designed for anyone who hasn’t been playing for a year or two—or wants to spend money. That’s CG’s ultimate goal. They want people to spend.
So most of the new stuff doesn’t really affect anyone who doesn’t already have a GL. Once you have one, it’s a lot easier to be picky with the second. That’s a lot more up in the air. After Kylo, SEE would be the easier path because Emperor Palpatine is required for both. And SEE covered SLKR’s main weakness: JML. The other main path was to go for JML. This was to have the best combo of LS and DS. JMK kind of broke that. JML is still an amazing GL, but he’s got a lot more utility than JML. The main question is if the more exclusive JMK requirements like R8, Wat, and Negotiator make up for JML requiring so many event characters, including JKL who is on par with GAS in terms of event requirements. LV adds a new wrinkle, but his requirements are possibly even harder than JMK.
Though JML and JMK are actually quite complementary GLs. Both use Jedi, so you kind of end up with a pool of Jedi to make both GL teams and maybe even a 3rd under JKR or JKL. But that’s more getting into second and third GLs. Neither are as entry-friendly as Kylo. And Rey is similar in that regard.
The only thing that might have changed is Rey. She’s a lot better than she was before because most of her counters were nerfed. She had been one of the easiest GLs to counter because there were so many teams. But it would still come down to Rey vs Kylo, and Kylo is still better in raids and the FO fleet is better than Resistance.
I can see some people suggesting going all-out on GLs now. If you’re able to get one before anyone else in your arena, you basically can’t be beaten anymore. There are some counters left, but they are ones that people just getting their first GL aren’t likely to have.
That being said, I still think the idea behind a plateau team is sound. The fastest way to speed things up without spending real money is with crystals from the arena. To do that, you need a good team while you’re working on SLKR.
I’m continuing on my journey towards DR, and making progress!
Meanwhile I’m 1-2 raids away from 7*ing Raid Han. I’ve got CLS and 6* 3PO, but no Chewies. If anyone has a moment and wants to have a look at my roster (gg account below), I’d really welcome any thoughts on how to best use CLS and Raid Han without any big investments that distract from DR. I feel like it’s probably Farmboy Luke, ST Han, Leia or maybe Biggs and Wedge…? I realize none are that great, but would like to maximize the value from CLS and Raid Han until I can spare the resources to build out the rebels. Thoughts?
Not to put too fine a point on it, but you’re probably not going to be building out Rebels any time soon. The way the game is right now, there’s no real incentive to do so. Ultimately, the best CLS team you can have is:
CLS (L), Raid Han, Chewie, C-3PO, and Chewpio
It’s incredibly good and fun to use because of the pure damage output. The main problem there is you get it as a byproduct of going for JML. JML is a great GL, but one that I really wouldn’t recommend as your first because of how many requirements there are. You want to get to a GL as soon as you reasonably can and JML is arguably one of the longest paths to go because of all the nesting requirements. Because of that, you kind of do have to go out of your way to work on that CLS team without doing JML.
As far as what you have now, I would probably say the best team you can use would probably be:
CLS (L), Raid Han, C-3PO, Biggs, and Wedge
I wouldn’t expect too much out of it. Wedge and Biggs are also needed for JML, so it’s not like you’d lose anything by putting some gear on them. The downside is Rebels are a glass canon team below G13 and especially without the Chewies. With Wiggs, you’re mainly relying on them to help do a bunch of basics that expose with C-3PO.
Rebels do have a bonus of also getting you most of a Rebel fleet. You do need Chewie for that, but Biggs is usually your tank. Wedge can be used early on as a Rebel unit to play off the Falcon, but there are better options and eventually Wedge gets left behind.
I would probably lean towards using that Rebel team I listed as-is and work on DR and then to your first GL. I think JML is a great second or third GL, so you would eventually get a Rebel team.
Thanks! Yeah, my expectations for the rebels are low, really want to just maximize CLS and Raid Han “as-is.” My main goals are DR —> Malak —> SLKR. That said, I noticed @Electricboa that you mentioned DR then GL. Is Malak still worth the effort after DR (I have JKR already)? Related, if I go for SLKR then I think I need Finalizer. Is that worth opportunistically working towards as my next capital ship, at the expense of say Malevolence?
It’s too bad that characters like CLS seem to be left in limbo - at least for players at my level. It seems like there’s no longer much incentive to get them, at least initially. I realize the game evolves with time, but it doesn’t feel very well thought out by CG - more like they make it up as they go. Such is life I suppose.
When I said DR, I was also counting Malak in there. You need Malak to make the DR as good as it can be. Without Malak, it’s missing a big part of what makes the team work.
You do need to get Finalizer for SLKR, so there’s not much of a choice there. You need the Finalizer at 5 stars. To get the finalizer, you need:
• First Order TIE Fighter
• Hound's Tooth
• Kylo Ren's Command Shuttle
• Slave I
• TIE Silencer
• TIE Advanced
• Xanadu Blood
It’s a good news/bad news situation. The good is most of the ships are good and you end up getting almost all the FO ships you’ll eventually use in a FO team, minus the FO SF TIE (which you will want, too). HT is a great ship independent of anything else, so having it will be a benefit for any fleet. Slave I and Xanadu Blood aren’t as good for you now. In the distant future, you’ll probably get the Executor and then they will be good. For now, it’s just a requirement you won’t have much use for.
I wouldn’t really put the Fianlizer over the Malevolence. It’s going to take you quite a while to get the requirements for SLKR done, so you’re not going to need the Finalizer for some time. The event comes back every 10-20 days. It unlocks at 4 stars and each time the event comes back, you can get 10 more blueprints. Needless to say, it’ll be a while before you 7-star it.
That being said, the Finalizer is a good offensive ship. You wouldn’t want to leave in on defense in your fleet arena or GAC. The Malevolence is far better there.
Yeah, it’s an unfortunate byproduct of so many event characters and GLs just kind of ruined any chance of a logical progression through teams. Once upon a time, the best strategy was to start with Phoenix, get Empire, then get R2 and CLS. That was when CLS was the meta. Then came JTR, who was completely separate, but it was still possible to jump from CLS to her. Now, almost no one is going to ever get JTR unless they’re going for Rey. But there was a path. You can see it on this old guide (which is wildly out of date now):
That triple cleanse team was probably the last teams that wasn’t heavily reliant on faction synergy to succeed.
And to a certain extent, CG makes the game with people who have been playing from the beginning in mind. JML is a good example of that. For you, it’s impractical to do him as your first GL, but for people who have been around from the beginning, we already had most of those characters already just playing through the metas as the evolved Wiggs was meta at once point. Whoever had the faster Biggs would win because it was a glass canon team.
It’s kind of a shame because the game does punish you for going for characters now that aren’t part of a larger strategy towards a GL. Chirrut and Baze are great characters, but they don’t lead to anything. Maybe if we get a Rebel GL, they’ll be needed. I could see a Leia GL down the line
But the game as it is now is all about getting a GL. And newer GLs are getting steeper and steeper requirements to the point that it’s impractical to even consider them first.
OK thanks - makes sense on DR and Malak. The reminder about timing for SLKR is helpful too. I tend to underestimate how long it takes and was thinking ahead. Onward with the DR and Malak farming!
I like how earlier on there were more interconnected paths, and getting a legendary character didn’t necessarily force you onto one path. But, I’m sure as the game grows it’s harder to do. I imagine there will be a slew of new characters after “The Book of Boba Fett” starts up, will be interesting to see if that happens and whether they go anywhere (the Mandos still seem fairly useless from my view as a newer player).
Hi all - quick question on the age-old 5th wheel for Empire squads.
I’m currently using Palp (L), Vader, Tarkin, Thrawn, and Fallen Bastila (who I recently used to replace TFP). Once I unlock DR (mid-way through that now) I’ll of course put Bastila on his squad. I’m debating then using Gideon or Dooku as the 5th for Empire. My Dooku just needs some gearing up whereas I’d have to finish farming Gideon (at the expense of FO farming for SLKR, my next goal after DR). My inclination is Dooku, but I realize Gideon is good overall - I’m just not sure if Gideon is worth the distraction in my FO farming at this point…?
Gideon is the better character, but I wouldn’t do him over any requirements for SLKR. You could actually use Gideon at 3 stars. His usefulness lies in his kit, so you don’t really need him to be 7-stars. The only place you’d need a character to be 7-stars are raids and TB. If you’re mainly just looking at GAC and TW, it’s not necessary. I actually used a G11 Gideon on my Trooper team while I was farming him and he was still pretty effective there.
Dooku is pretty good on his own and will definitely be used later on in DS Geo TB. He can shock, which helps feed Palpatine. He also applies a lot of debuffs and can stun, so he works well under a Palpatine lead.
A slight consideration is Dooku is a marginally easier gear - Gideon has kyrotech requirements prior to getting relics. However, his other gear requirements besides kyrotech are actually not terrible.
I would at this point advise upon even a low star, low gear Gideon over Dooku. Demoralized will give your no-tank Empire squad more survivability, armor shred will help you really punch through a difficult enemy, mass daze is amazing, and his TM reset can be devastating if timed right. Electricboa gave me this advice once upon a time, and I have found it to be true of course - Dooku doesn't really sing until you get him to relics, so unless you're planning that, I would say that even a low gear Gideon would give you more return on investment than say a G11 or G12 Dooku.
Thanks @Electricboa and @Themistocles - as typical, your insights are helpful and appreciated. I would’ve leaned to Dooku but see that Gideon might be worth a go even at lower levels. Realistically I won’t get Dooku geared up to Relic or even G12 in the short term (too much gearing for DR then Malak). Still, I see Dooku’s long term value so will work on him as able.
Hi all - earlier in this thread we were talking fleet. My main fleet now is Executrix with the geos and a few TIE fighter variants. My next step would be Malevolence. But, I’m also hoping to start on SLKR somewhat soonish which I assume means farming Finalizer. Is it worth farming both (and their support fleets) at the same time, or is their a clear priority? Appreciate any thoughts…
Get Hyena Bomber, Vulture Droid squared away to 7 star. HT to ~G12. Geos to G12.
Malevolence is the far easier ship to climb with. Once you have that consistency of fleet crystals, everything in the game becomes so much easier.
Malevolence is the better fleet by far, but you’re going to be stuck behind the GET II currency for it for a while. A lot depends on how fast you get that currency. But that’s the fleet you’re looking to transition to.
The Finalizer is a decent offensive fleet, but it’s mainly useful in GAC. It’s not that great on defense, so it’s not going to have as much use in your fleet arena. SLKR only requires the Finalizer at 5 stars, which is good because it’ll take you a long time to get it to 7-stars without spending on refreshes, and it’s not worth spending anything on anyway.
Keep in mind, the Finalizer requires the following:
• First Order TIE Fighter
• Hound's Tooth
• Kylo Ren's Command Shuttle
• Slave I
• TIE Silencer
• TIE Advanced
• Xanadu Blood
You probably won’t beat the event until you gave the FO pilots geared at the required level for SLKR. HT is the other important ship. You might as well plan on gearing up Bossk, too. His ship is just too good not to have.
Malevolence really only needs Hyena and Vulture, since you already have Geos. HT can work in there, too, so he can be good for both.
As far as which one to prioritize, I would say it entirely depends on when you think you’ll unlock the Malevolence. All things being equal, I’d do that first. Gearing the FO pilots will take some time and even after you finish the Finalizer event, you unlock it at 4-stars. You need to wait for the event to return at least 6 more times to 5-star it (you need 7 attempts on the bonus tier total, but you can do it once when you first complete the event)
Also, you might want to look at how much Prestige you have. To fully max everything on a 7-star ship, you need 1,950 prestige. You won’t be able to fully upgrade all the abilities at 5-stars. At 5-stars, you should need 1,030 prestige. The Malevolence unlocks at 5-stars.
OK, great. Sounds like I’ll start with Malevolence since it’s the better ship and I’d want it anyway. Whenever I’m the SLKR journey I get to the pilots and ships, so be it (good news is I’ve got four of the ships for Finalizer already, but not at the necessary levels). I’m admittedly just starting with Malevolence- had to make a guild change.
Hi all - curious how folks would prioritize mods. I’m debating upgrading some 5 dot mods to 6 dot. My choices are Empire squad (Palp, Tarkin, Thrawn), Sith-Empire (HK or Fallen Bastilla), JKR, or save until I activate DR. I’m tempted to upgrade HK but also feel like waiting for DR is the better long term move?
On a related note, I’m about 20 shards away from 7* on my last character (Carth) for DR - hopefully will be pushing for DR very soon!
…and, finally took everyone’s advice and switched guilds. While I really liked my old guild, my new one is so much more active and in higher events. Thanks for the push!
The main argument against upgrading mods to Mk 6 is only G12 characters and above can use those mods. That can be problematic if you upgrade you best mods and then you can’t use them on events where you’re getting by with characters geared below G12.
As an example, you probably won’t have everyone at G12 for the DR event. Even the Malak event, you’re only required to meet a minimum GP for each character. That can be done at G11 with a zeta.
As far as which characters can make use of upgraded mods, it depends on what you’re looking to upgrade. Going from Mk 5 to Mk 6 is mostly about the primary stat. A good example is health. You have a +5.88% health primary on Mk 5 which becomes +16% at Mk 6. But a protection primary goes from +23.5% to 24%, which is almost nothing.
But there’s another reason to take mods to Mk 6 and that’s to upgrade them farther. That’s usually about trying to get extra speed rolls. If you’re lucky enough to get it to roll the maximum of 4 times on speed, it will show (5) next to the speed secondary.
A quick aside on how speed secondaries roll. Each time, you get 3-6 speed per roll plus the initial one. So you have to get lucky on the roll being speed, but then there’s another added layer of luck that determines how much speed you get. The lowest a maxed-out speed secondary can be is +15, which is as likely as getting the highest, which is +30. In my experience, the average is about +24 or +25. My fastest maxed one is +27 and my slowest is +20.
All that applies to ever stat. There’s always a range to what you get. It’s just that most people don’t care about anything except speed. But you’ll sometimes max out another secondary in the process.
Some characters care about speed more than others. DR and Fallen Bastila are very reliant on being fast. JKR and Thrawn are two others that usually do well with speed. Thrawn because he can pass TM to anyone on your team who probably has a lower base speed and JKR going first gets the ball rolling on the TM gain for GMY.
But as far as just going from Mk 5 to Mk 6 for the primaries? Usually, G13 characters benefit the most there and you’ve already done Vader. You might want to consider remodding Vader, though. That tenacity cross isn’t really doing much. Vader does better with offense or potency there. The health triangle could go, too, for an offense or crit damage primary. And a crit chance set doesn’t really matter too much. He gets a good amount of extra crit chance from his kit.
Oh, another place where going from Mk 5 to Mk 6 would make a difference is for ships. You do get a boost in you ship stats by having Mk 6 mods on your pilots. But that’s more for down the line when you have more G12 and G13 pilots.
Ah, that’s a really good point about my Vader mods. I put those on him way-back-when because I didn’t have anything better and these at least had speed and some offense secondaries. So really good reminder to go back through and make updates.
Speaking of G13…I’m aiming for Palp as my next one (at least until I can unlock DR) since my Empire squad is still serviceable and I figure I need him at relic for SLKR eventually anyway. I’d think my other options would be JKR or just hoard resources until DR joins the roster. Longer term I’d aim for all of them, but curious if there’s a clear next best option.
I would probably save the gear for DR. You will eventually have to G13 Palpatine, but it looks like you’re close to DR and Sith Empire is a much better team. Especially after the Vader nerf.
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